Gilraen's Linnod

[Elbereth]

Okay, so perhaps this is just one of those things that only the crazy Tolkien people can notice, but did anyone notice the mispronounciation of Gilraen's linnod when Elrond is talking to Aragorn in the paviliions of Rohan at - I think - Dunharrow?

Onen i estel Edain...
U-chebin estel anim

Elrond pronounces it as "oh-nen ee ehs-tehl ee-dah-een", and Aragorn responds with "oo-che-been ehs-tehl ah-neem".

Aragorn's pronounciation is correct, but each part of the linnod should be seven syllables, totalling fourteen. Edain should be pronounced as "ee-daeen", without breaking it into three syllables, which, yes, is tough to do.

I just thought to point that out.

~ Elbereth

[Lady Elwen]

Yay!!! Applause!!! Someone else who noticed that!! I've been complaining about that since I saw RoTK when it came out on DVD... No one quite gets it. I caught that and then went and analyzed the structure of a linnod, and figured it out. It bugs me, although, granted, the actual pronounciation of it can be heard two different ways... Oh well.

~ Elwen

[Angel]

okay, not quite shocking, but ive never noriced that lol (you can tell i take elvish for granted and never really look further into it) *sigh*

~ Angel ~

[Lady Elwen]

*laughs* That's probably a good thing - I've spent way too much time analyzing Elvish language structure than is good for me....

But I'd have thought the language coaches would have caught that... Maybe they just heard it differently, since the difference between "ee-dah-een" and "ee-daeen" is fairly subtle, depending on speed, sound, and voice quality.... *shrugs*

If there's one other person that I think might have noticed, it might be Ana - the Elvish guru around here and PE.

~ Elwen

[Elbereth]

Yeah, that can be misheard, so I suppose it goes both ways... Maybe my speakers are just terrible or something and they did in actuality pronounce it correctly... But as far as I'm concerned, that line should have been re-recorded to mitigate any confusion...

I've heard a lot of people pronouncing it "ee-dah-een" with the three distinct syllables lately... I like to blame it on this scene...

~ Elbereth

[Lady Elwen]

And actually, may I just say that I only just now caught the mispronunciation (phonetically) for edain? It's "ee-dine", in all actuality, since the "ai" is pronounced as the "i" in English "high".....

Will say more later...

~ Elwen

[Natalie]

see that last bit there confused me Elwen but i wil skip that and go on to the point of this post...

In the theatrical version I have Elrond pronounces it "eh-dah-een" but in the EE i have he pronounces it "ee-dine"

So I'm gueesing they did do some work on it, cos I waited AGES before i got the ee one so I dunno..

Maybe Elrond syas it differently cos he's half elven *shrugs*

~Natalie

[Anaroriel]

*gasp* Oh dear, I had never heard that before! *in shock* And then I pulled out my non EE-Rotk and kept rewinding and playing Elrond's words over and over again, just in case he would say it correctly one of the times. And he didn't!

Well, I guess it was one of those things I took for granted. I had assumed that they would say it right. Silly me.

Wow, that's great that you caught it though.

And when did I become the Elvish guru?

No matter. And it is pronounced like e-dine. Whatever way did you pronounce it before? It was even in one of Christopher Tolkien's notes in one of the HoME series... no wait, I think it was the Silmarillion where he described it as e-dine. Erm, somewhere.

Anyway, but Elrond says it right on the EE? Hmm, I must look into that.

And I don't think the fact that Elrond's character is half-Elven excuses him from pronouncing it wrong.

[Lady Elwen]

*laughs* Sorry Nat... I meant that the "ai" in Elvish is supposed to sound like a single "i". So edain would therefore be "ee-dine", as opposed to "ee-daeen".

And I don't think he does say it right in the EE, either... I'll have to check one of these days when I have a spare minute...

And yeah, I thought they'd say it right, too, but I have this thing where I was trying to get phonetic spelling for the Elvish, and found a really good set of speakers, so I was listening to all the Elvish dialogue with my back to the screen and the volume way up, when I noticed him saying "ee-dah-een". It bugged the life out of me.

Haha Ana.... You kind of are the Elvish guru - one of the only people around this type of site that can actually verify and understand the languages... ;D

And no, being a pereldar doesn't excuse mispronunciation on his part - he would have had an Elvish mother, grown up speaking the tongues, and he would have had to speak them correctly to be understood. Sindarin's Sindarin wherever they speak it, kind of like English, or any other language - they don't say "dog" three different ways from here to Africa; it's always going to be one syllable, beginning with d, and ending with g.

Sorry... Spending way too much time with linguists and gramarians lately...........

~ Elwen

[Natalie]

oh right see that made much more sense...

I have two editions of rotk EE (ones from the Us and the other i bough here in the UK)
And they're different, the US one has an extra added easter egg...was shocked at that, and there has been new release of the EE's here recently so i have no idea...

*Laughs* I have actually two friends who say dog differently, its kinda funny, but they are weird so i wouldn't be surprised...

Yeah i think you have Elwen

~Natalie

[Lady Elwen]

Okay then - good to know!!

Oh really? Well, then maybe he does say it differently!! But that's a bit strange...

Shh!! Don't blow my cover!! Just kidding... But you get my point!

*laughs* Yeah, I have... But oh well... beats other things... Hehe

~ Elwen